Israel, Turkey, Syria: Are We Watching WWIII Start? | Jack & Charles

Charles: if we're the United States, who we should be helping out or doing deals with. The way it is right now, it should not be Syria. It should be Turkey. And if anybody's doing business with Syria, we should be asking ourselves, are they actually our allies or not?

Jack Moore: Welcome to Moore to Consider, Jack and Charles. Alright, so here, more to consider, please like and subscribe. Please comment. if you're on some of the other platforms like the Apple Podcast, if you're on Spotify, please go in there and leave some nice reviews for us. So Charles and I talk all the time off the air. We catch up with each other, and we're like, what are we going to talk about next time we do a show? So Charles sent me this from the Associated Press. Israeli strikes hit an airbase hours after a Turkish delegation visited had come into a visit, Syrian officials say. And the date on this is was it to yesterday? no, August yeah, August nineteenth. So August 21 when we're doing this. So within about forty-eight hours, this had come out. So Damascus, Syria. A Turkish delegation had visited an airbase in northern Syria the day before it was hit by Israeli airstrikes. Syrian officials said the Israeli strikes hit the base early Tuesday, hours after the delegation had left, causing damage but no casualties. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's office said in a statement that Israel had attacked the base because Syria was on the verge of breaching an agreed upon status quo in security matters by allowing Turkish.

Charles: I could not think of a a quicker way for World War Three to start if you know, Israel and Turkey have been having issues over the past several months anyway. And if you remember, Netanyahu was quite pissed that Trump was willing to sell F thirty fives to Turkey and they're like, Why are you gonna do that? And he's like, Well, they're part of NATO. Why wouldn't I? I mean, we had nuclear missiles in in Turkey Why can't they have some planes? And Netanyahu again is having a fit about this. But this whole issue in Syria I find awfully interesting the fact that Bal Assad, I'm I'm gonna mess the guy's name up. The guy who was the president of Syria before the current dude who was one of the leaders of ISIS. That's who they have as a president now in Syria. There's pictures of this guy holding heads that were just recently chopped off. He was in ISIS. So we over we overthrew Syria who was led by pretty much a a non religious he wasn't a religious zealot, he was more like the guy who was a Hussein in Jordan. Yeah, it's a Muslim country, but that's about it. Kind of like Turkey is yeah, Turkey Turkey is officially a Muslim country. But I've been to Turkey. It's it's barely Muslim. I mean barely, barely Muslim. When you can go to a restaurant and you can you can have sausage and and ham and stuff like that, that means they're not very Muslim. But anyway, Syria kind of sorta used to be that way. Now they're being run by a guy who, like as I said earlier, was one of the top guys in ISIS. So Turkey and and Israel have been having these issues and Israel decided to drop some bombs on in in Syria a few hours after the Turkish delegation had left. Now just imagine this. Just imagine and by the way, this air base is only like forty three miles away from the Turkish border. Imagine if Israel goes to attack Turkey. Well, Israel's not part of NATO. Turkey is. By contract, we are obligated to support Turkey. And so is the rest of NATO. But the huge question nowadays is this. If Israel did go and do something like that, would we do what we're obligated to do, which is to support Turkey, or would we turn a blind eye again and And let Israel do whatever the hell they want. That's a real question. And I don't think we would be asking or some of us would be asking that same question two years ago, but the way things have been going over the past year, I I do think it's up. Mm-hmm.

Jack Moore: Alright, stop right there. You're saying all right, you're saying that two years ago, same circumstances, the US would have gone right in and sided with Turkey and did some kind of retaliation.

Charles: I think that the United States would have would have had an absolute fit about this and done all kinds of I'm sorry. We would have thought that the United States would have done what they needed to do, what they're obligated to do when it comes to Article five of the the NATO Charter. Right.

Jack Moore: Alright, so isn't Israel though in part have a way out here though because they lobbed something into Syria?

Charles: No, no, no. I'm saying hypothetically, if if again, remember, Syria Israel and Turkey are having issues right now. They're having issues. Hypothetically, if Israel goes and attacks Turkey, what are we supposed to do? We're ob I'm just I'm saying hypothetically, man. I'm speaking hypothetically. Okay. So if that were the case

Jack Moore: Right. But they did not. You would agree but you would agree they did not. No, I understand. I understand. Understand. But I think this was their way this was their backdoor way around it.

Charles: No, I don't no, I don't think so because they could have attacked the the Turkish delegation while they were there, but the problem with that would have been Turkey would have had a fit and would have attacked Israel.

Jack Moore: Well, okay. I I'm I'm I'm just hey I'm playing devil's advocate.

Charles: But again, I'm speaking hypotheticals here.

Jack Moore: I know I know you are, but I'm saying I'm just playing devil's advocate. If I wanted to make a statement, you let Turkish troops go into Syria, I'm Israel, naughty naughty, didn't like that, and I don't want to create the very type of draw li drawing crossing the line that you've that you've established or that you have discussed. How about if I lob some stuff in after the Turkish troops get out? Send a statement, lob them into Syria, not Turkey, and didn't hit any Turkish officials at the time I did it. It's kind of point made, but I haven't actually crossed the line that you're establishing.

Charles: Well no no, but what is the what is the point then? Why'd he do it?

Jack Moore: The point you make in the statement.

Charles: A statement about what?

Jack Moore: Well, okay, again, I'm not really well versed in this. I'm I'm I'm kind of like the Israeli strikes were hours after the delegation had left, causing damage but no casualties. Benjamin Netanyahu's office said in the statement that Israel had had attacked the base because Syria was on the verge of breaching an agreed upon status quo in security matters by allowing Turkish troops to deploy there. So he's I think he's saying it right there. He's making a statement, hey, hey, hey, hey Syria, you're letting these Turkish guys in. That's in violation of a ongoing agreement that we had that you keep the Turkish troops out. What's that?

Charles: Yeah, but there is really troops there's really troops in Syria. So what?

Jack Moore: I I'm I'm sorry. Okay. I think it's clear what Israel's

Charles: I mean I I don't understand.

Jack Moore: doing and I think what Israel's doing is not lobbing bombs into Turkey and they don't seem to be striking Turkish troops, but they're making a statement. That's all I'm saying is what on the surface Yeah.

Charles: But I but I don't understand what the statement is.

Jack Moore: All right. I again I'm only reading from this. Benjamin in Nahu's office said in the statement that Israel had attacked the okay. Why did you do it, Isra Israel? let's let's talk to Minister, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's office. Let's find out what he says. He says we attack the base because Syria was on the verge of breaching an agreed upon status quo. I would I would think, based upon the language and and and the delivery here, that he means Israel and Syria had an agreement. And they were on the verge of breaching it an agreed upon status quo in security matters by allowing Turkish troops to deploy there.

Charles: Okay. Alright. I I hear what you're saying. But the problem with that is haven't we heard that a thousand times from Israel? And and there's been

Jack Moore: I'm not I'm not getting into questions of how many times we've heard it. I said I think what's on the service, two Syrian officials who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to comment said the Turkish delegation had visited the airbase in the northwestern province on Monday to review rehabilitation work underway at the facility. It was the first confirmation of a Turkish presence at the base, and Turkish and Syrian officials have not publicly commented on Turkey's role, but they have all c also condemned the attack. as US ambassador to Turkey, Tom Barak, guess that's right, Tom Barak, who also serves as special envoy to Syria. Turkish officials on Wednesday did not comment on the reported presence of Turkish military delegation. But it sounds like I'm just saying, it sounds like from what I'm reading here, Israel has made it clear, or there's been some kind of a quasi-agreement of some type with Syria that they don't allow these Turkish troops in or make some kind of connection with

Charles: So because they don't like this Syria is

Jack Moore: I'm not making a value judgment on whether they're right or wrong, but I said I it looks like to me what they're doing is they're making a statement and trying to lessen the potential consequence. As you've said, Turkey member of NATO. It might trigger this y you know, the these rules relative to backing other NATO countries, having some obligation to do so. I think it was a way of like, all right, we'll wait till the Turkey Turkish officials get out or whatever or they get out of harm's way. We'll lob a couple of bombs and go, Syria, you better watch out what you're doing here. And I think that's the statement.

Charles: Man, how many times is we gonna allow them to just do whatever the hell they want, man? I mean if if Syria wants to talk to Turkey, that's between them. What the hell does Israel have to do with it?

Jack Moore: Well, you're arguing a different point. Y you're arguing Okay.

Charles: Well no, this is the point. No, that that is the exact point. If Syria wants to talk to Turkey, what the hell does it have to do with Israel?

Jack Moore: Well apparently something that Israel believes is some type of agreement they have with Syria.

Charles: What the bruh, again, man, how many times do we have to go through not you and I, but I'm just speaking in generality. How

Jack Moore: W Yeah.

Charles: many times we have to do have to go through this where they just keep butting their nose into other people's business?

Jack Moore: Well, when you say we, I think you you you might be questioning like what would be US response potentially.

Charles: Well d yeah. No, actually no. No. This is the thing. We don't have anything to do with it either.

Jack Moore: we as in the United States. Right. I agree with that.

Charles: The United States. We don't have anything to do with it either. Unless unless Israel attacks Turkey.

Jack Moore: Exactly. I I I get what you're saying there because

Charles: Then we have something to do with it.

Jack Moore: right, 'cause that could trigger some level of agreement between these NATO nations that something has to be done in defense of Turkey. Fair? That's

Charles: That's that's correct, yes.

Jack Moore: why I think this whole thing was orchestrated by Israel to play fast and loose at the edges, but not to cross the line. I think that's what it looks like.

Charles: Why can't he just leave people alone?

Jack Moore: Well, that's a whole different argument. That's a whole bit different discussion.

Charles: Man, 'cause I still don't understand what the necessity for them to drop bombs in Syria's for. I I just don't. If they don't

Jack Moore: Well

Charles: like what Syria w who Syria's friends are or who they are talking to, too fucking bad.

Jack Moore: All right, well, okay. Unless I I don't know. I'm d I look, I'm a total novice on this stuff. This is not anything that I have any depth of knowledge in. But if Benjamin Netanyahu's office was making some statement regarding to the why, and they said it's because we had a some kind of a ongoing agreement with Syria. that for securities purposes or whatever the wording there was, they would not let me let me just let me let me go back and find office said the statement that Israel had attacked the base because Syria was here you go. Syria was on the verge of breaching And agreed upon status quo in security matters. Now, breaching, you know, is a legal term. You know, we when you go to law school and you kind of learn what breaching of contract is, there's some material aspect of the contract or the agreement that you're not complying with. So breach is the kind of thing that implies agreement. To breach, there has to be some kind of agreement to have a breach. So they're saying that you're on the verge of breaching and agreed upon, agreed upon, which sounds like an agreement. status quo and security matters by allowing Turkish troops to deploy there. So I think what we'd have to know to talk for me to speak intelligently on this, I'd have to know was there some kind of working agreement between Syria and Israel? That Israel and and Syria had come to an agreement saying, nah, don't let the Turkish forces be playing across your borders or whatever. If that's true, good. Well you might not like it, but you you might not

Charles: Isn't Yeah. Isn't it No no?

Jack Moore: like it. You may think that Israel twisted their arm or something, but is there such an agreement in place?

Charles: D you know what's so funny about this th

Jack Moore: Mm-hmm.

Charles: what's so funny about this? That Israel had a agreement with Syria with the person or the group of people that we were told were the worst people on the planet, such as ISIS. So now Israel has agreements with ISIS. And we we should sit here and think really be concerned about what they think. Does that make any sense whatsoever?

Jack Moore: Well, okay.

Charles: None man. It makes no so they're siding with ISIS against the people who we

Jack Moore: Y yeah, okay.

Charles: have treaties with such as Turkey who has been our ally for a very long time, but we're gonna side with the ISIS people. Does that make any sense?

Jack Moore: I'm gonna go down a bad I'm or I'm gonna go down a bad road. I was actually talking about something legally the other day, some of the twisted things that you see, and it was when I was a prosecutor. I had a kid one time that was a victim of a crime. I was actually talking about having unclean hands. It might have been on the show with you, but guy gets in the backseat of a car, there's two kids in the front, and he has on his person $750 in cash. Guess what he expects when he brings the $750? What do you think he's expecting in return?

Charles: I do I have no okay.

Jack Moore: Drugs, drugs. So he gets in the car. He gets in the car. It's an agreed upon. It's an agreed upon drug deal, right? He gets in the backseat

Charles: Okay.

Jack Moore: of the car and he says, Hey guys, I got the seven fifty. One of them turns around with the gun and goes, Yeah, we'll take that and we'll keep the drug, get the hell out of the car. Is that an armed robbery?

Charles: I I I I I'm okay.

Jack Moore: It is. It's an armed robbery. They took $750 from him and they pointed a gun in his face. It's an armed robbery. But what's

Charles: Okay.

Jack Moore: a little bit of a problem if you're the prosecutor in that case?

Charles: I don't know no man.

Jack Moore: He's there to do a drug buy.

Charles: Okay.

Jack Moore: He's there to do a drug buy and gets a gun stuck in his face. And I was talking about this very thing the other day. Sometimes you don't have the best victims. I was making the point that a lot of people are victims of crimes that are in a world of crime all the time. Doesn't mean they're not victims. There there's a whole ring of things that happens in the streets where informants sometimes find where two people are going to meet for a drug buy. Guess who shows up? Third party with guns. And they steal the drugs and the gun. They steal the drugs and the money. Now Are the the the guy with the drugs there for the drug buying the guy there with the money, are they both victims of a crime?

Charles: yes.

Jack Moore: Are they less likely to want to go to the cops because they were there for a drug buy? Maybe, right? Now this kid actually went to the police. So in that jurisdiction I was in, the Prosecutor's office would often split the so we had two defendants, the guy with the gun, and the guy said, Give get give me the drugs or give me the money. And they were split. So I go to a preliminary hearing one day on it, and a cop sees me in the hallway, a detective that I knew well, and he goes, Jack, you're just dropping the whole thing. You're gonna null price. I'm I am and he goes, Yeah, it's street justice. We've already taken care of it. I'm like, what are you gonna do? And he goes, The one kid paid $350, the other kid's gonna pay $350 or $375. They're gonna pay $375 apiece. Give the kid a $750. Back and everybody's gonna walk away. The kid's getting his money back. He doesn't want to testify. He doesn't want to open himself up to a defense attorney, ask him a bunch of questions. And I'm like, all right, if that's good. He goes, Yeah, your colleague in the office has already agreed to it. But what I'm saying is, if you are don't like Israel or some maybe maybe in the mechanics of some of the things they do when it comes to foreign policy, you know, their diplomacy with other countries, their interactions, whatever, if they came to some kind of an agreement. With Syria relative to whether Turkish forces are on the bases or everything else. That's their agreement. If it exists. Now, if you can if you can pull up that it doesn't exist, I'm not justifying Israel lobbing bombs in. What I'm saying is there's a difference between a justification and explanation. Their explanation

Charles: No

Jack Moore: was, yeah, we told those Turkish officials, I mean the Syrian officials to keep these guys out.

Charles: No, I un I understand exactly what you mean, but I'm talking about going back further. W

Jack Moore: And they maybe they may be bad guys. Yeah, good.

Charles: I'm talking about going back further than that.

Jack Moore: Yeah.

Charles: Further than that. Remember, ISIS was the worst group of people on the planet. Remember that? That's what we were told for a long time, right?

Jack Moore: What does that have to do with whether or not Israel had set settled Okay, got go, go, okay.

Charles: I'm getting there. I'm I'm getting there. I'm getting there. Were they not the w the worst group of people that we were told on the planet?

Jack Moore: Other than the young lady I remember from the television show when I was a kid, that ISIS. I was I was you remember that? Did you ever watch that? Okay. Yeah, but I the other one was

Charles: N no no I'm t I'm talking about the ISIS, the one the offshoot of Al Qaeda.

Jack Moore: was was a very was we all loved that one the Saturday morning thing, that ISIS, but that was different. Really? Okay, okay. Okay.

Charles: I have no idea what you're talking about, but I'm talking about this one here. I have no idea. So but this ISIS was the worst group of people on the planet. That's what we were told for several years. Do you remember that?

Jack Moore: Mm-hmm. I do, yeah.

Charles: Okay. So we installed one of the top members of ISIS. We overthrew Balasad, Alistair Balasad, whatever his name was, the the President of Syria, we overthrew him and installed with the help of the Israelis, installed one of the heads of ISIS.

Jack Moore: Okay.

Charles: So now are they our friends? And I'm not talking about Israel, I'm talking about the guy who's in charge of I Syria right now. Is he just all of a sudden our friend now? Or should I have believed what you told me years ago that these were the worst group of people on the planet? But they're now Israel now is doing deals with them, making agreements with them. But I thought they were the worst people on the planet. And them doing deals with them, they're saying, no no no, Syria, you can't do deals or make agreements with Turkey, who has been one of our most staunch allies for the past fifty, sixty years. So if you have a choice as to who if we're the United States, who we should be helping out or doing deals with. The way it is right now, it should not be Syria. It should be Turkey. And if anybody's doing business with Syria, we should be asking ourselves, are they actually our allies or not? That's the question that people are asking right now when it comes to what will happen if Israel attacked Turkey. Will we just turn our back on remember, we've talked about this months ago about how much of an ally Turkey was because of where they were geographically. They were literally on the front line when it comes to during the Cold War. Yeah.

Jack Moore: During the Cold War. We got into the whole thing about the Cuban Missile Crisis and pulling the yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Charles: Yeah, so they went through a lot because of us, because they were our ally. We can't turn our back on on on Turkey. But what happens if Israel attacks them? That's that's the the sixty four thousand dollar question based on all the things that we've you know, allowed them to do over the past year or so. That's what people are asking. I'm not the only one. I'm not.

Jack Moore: I I I'm trying to think of the right term. I I'm trying to think of the right term as far as whatever The heck is going on between you know I'm kind of looking at right now. yeah, Israel and Syria signed an agreement of disengagement 1974, created a UN monitored buffer zone. under its new leadership in 2025, it's the basis of renewed negotiations with Israel. Yes, da-da-da-da. So they've had a ceasefire maintenance, the UN peacekeeping force in 2025, following the fall of Bashir. Al-Assad's regime, Syria's new leadership, reaffirmed the seventy-four agreement as a foundation of renewed negotiations. This includes a potential shift towards diplomatic engagement between the two nations after a decade, or have decades of conflict. So what are the terms? but it seems like as far as the discussion goes, on the one hand, you seem to be saying Israel. made it s appear that Syria, based upon its history, has been depicted by Israel as a country not really worthy of much what's the term I'm looking for? don't put much stock in in who they are or what they do and yet They are making a reference to some type of agreement in justification for lobbying these bombs. Fair?

Charles: That's what they claim.

Jack Moore: Okay, right. They claim one thing. You're questioning why is it now Israel says they have an agreement with Syria where they badmouthed their credibility in the past.

Charles: Not just them, we did.

Jack Moore: Okay. But

Charles: Yeah, we do.

Jack Moore: again, I'm just looking at the black and white mechanics of it, and the mechanics of it appear to me to be I don't have anything to come back at you with. I can see that Israel did not have some kind of a agreement of some type to keep Turkish officials out, Turkish troops, whatever whatever the contact was, and that Syria might have been in violation of that.

Charles: No well, this is the thing. I do no no.

Jack Moore: Which may not justify dro lobbing bombs in, but and we're the same.

Charles: No, I don't really care what their agreement was. That's the whole thing. I don't I d I truly don't care what their agreement was. I don't care.

Jack Moore: Well, Charles not Charles not agreeing doesn't really trump whatever agreement they have or whatever actions they take.

Charles: No no, hop hold on, but this is don't look at it from a legal point of view, okay? This is literally

Jack Moore: I can't help but look at everything from a legal standpoint.

Charles: yeah, but sometimes that's not how things work, man. And in this is one of those instances it doesn't hold on, hold

Jack Moore: Then then what? So Charles, all right, so so Charles, okay, so what? So what? This whole thing, so what? Does America go and attack Israel

Charles: So what?

Jack Moore: right now?

Charles: Actually hold on no no, but this is why it matters, man. Because if it gets to the point

Jack Moore: It may matter, but I'm asking you what's the answer?

Charles: This this is w this is why it matters. If it gets to the point where s Israel attacks Turkey for

Jack Moore: Yeah.

Charles: being in Syria because Syria wants to have a relationship with Turkey and and

Jack Moore: Okay.

Charles: Israel doesn't like it, that's why I don't give a shit what i if Israel likes it or not. Because it could actually affect us. That's why I don't care what it what agreement that they have. That's why I don't I don't care if I really don't care what agreement Israel has with ISIS. I don't care. Because it really could affect us.

Jack Moore: Okay, so what's America's move?

Charles: America's move is with the the it should have been the same move that should have been the same move from years ago. Stop giving them money so they can actually drop bombs on other people. Stop doing that. But we keep doing it.

Jack Moore: Okay. So in response to what all right, you brought up this case. I read out what was reported. That's as we we got that far. It appears that in what Israel did, it did not send, correct me when I'm wrong, but it did not send any type of missile, lobbed a bomb or any it didn't drop a bomb, didn't do anything relative to an actual attack on Turkey.

Charles: That's why I said it w that's why I started with this being a hypothetical in the first place, Rand.

Jack Moore: Well, we we can get to the hypotheticals, but w we're starting from what's

Charles: That I no no. I didn't want to go past my hypothetical.

Jack Moore: Well what if Israel are what what if an Israel what if Israel sent a missile over to the United States?

Charles: Do it. The question right now is, would we do anything about it?

Jack Moore: Okay, that we could play those hypotheticals. Israel lobs bombs on the US. Okay. All

Charles: Yeah.

Jack Moore: right. So then you'd say, well, we can have that discussion. What I'm saying is all we're operating from is Israel, apparently, sent some type of bombs, weapons, missiles into Syria based upon their disapproval that Turkish troops or whatever had been there and were out. So they didn't make it.

Charles: Dude, I'm talking about a hypothetical. You keep I'm not even talking about what you just said. I'm talking about a hypothetical it dude,

Jack Moore: But then what what are we talking about then?

Charles: don't talk man, I started this out with a dude, listen to what I'm saying, man. Listen to what I'm saying. I'm t

Jack Moore: What are we talking about? I d I I don't understand what we're talking about. Okay, go ahead. Yeah.

Charles: I'm speaking on a hypothetical. What if Israel attacks Turkey? That's all I'm talking about.

Jack Moore: Yeah. What makes you think they will?

Charles: Listen, man. That's all I'm talking about. I'm not talking about them dropping bombs in Syria, nothing like

Jack Moore: Well Okay.

Charles: that. I'm saying what happens if Israel attacks Turkey? That's all I'm talking about. Exactly, it would be a giant mess, man.

Jack Moore: I think there would be a big mess. I think there'd be a big mess. But I think if you said, what if Israel lobbed bombs on the United States, would there be a big mess? Yeah, it probably would be. There's probably a lot of there's probably a lot

Charles: I again, man, I'm only

Jack Moore: of other nations. If the if if Israel attack a lot of other nations there'd probably be problems.

Charles: But the question is who would we support?

Jack Moore: Okay, so you n now you're going down a different road. I think we're now finally getting somewhere. No,

Charles: No, no, no, no, no. That was my hypothetical in the first place.

Jack Moore: your hypothetical was what if they attack Turkey?

Charles: Do do listen to what I'm saying, man. I don't know, maybe you forgot what I was saying, man, because I I'm repeating it now. I said the

Jack Moore: I I d I re I real yeah.

Charles: same thing at the very beginning. What would happen if Israel attacks Turkey? Who would we support? That's my that's the entire point of this, man. Who would we support? Even though we're obligated to support?

Jack Moore: Okay. Okay. And I apologize to the audience. I okay. I got I gotcha. I apologize. I thought you were seeing what happened as an attack on Turkey. That's why I thought we were reading the story.

Charles: No, no. This has been a hypothetical from the very start. No. We I can see

Jack Moore: Well, I know you you kept saying hypothetical, but i I didn't see where Turkey was really ever being attacked and I didn't see any design that Israel had to attack Turkey. I thought what they were doing was spanking Syria for having Turkey in. I didn't think that was an attack on Turkey necessarily.

Charles: But remember I s I started this by saying that Israel and Turkey have been having words as of late.

Jack Moore: Yeah, okay.

Charles: And and Israel has been pissed off at the United States for for giving Turkey those F thirty fives. So

Jack Moore: Gotcha. Alright, well let me ask you this. Where do you think s what do you think Israel has more of a tension for? Syria or Turkey?

Charles: What do you can you be a little more specific?

Jack Moore: Who do they dislike the most?

Charles: Probably Turkey.

Jack Moore: Okay. So the reason I'm saying that is there there could be a couple of ways to look at this. And again, I'm a novice, all this. I'm going with you. You know the Middle East better than I ever know. But there could be some things. There could be, son of a bitch, we told Syria stop holding hands with Turkey, don't be having them over, that kind of thing. Let's lob some bombs in to give them a message directed at Syria. There could be another one. Son of a bitch, we told Turkey stop going into Syria, or we have tension with them. The fact that they were in and out was since we can't directly attack Turkey, let's lob some bombs on Syria. Syria to make them feel bad. You know, it seems to me to be more directed at Syria, but it might be because they had somebody they didn't want in there, or it's kind of quasi-directed at Turkey. That's really the question. It sounds like from what you're saying, it's bad blood with Turkey that's driving this just as much as Syria, you broke whatever loose agreement this was. You have been in violation of our agreement.

Charles: You have to question you have to start questioning certain people's motives when they do exactly the opposite of what they're saying. So I'm just gonna read this.

Jack Moore: Okay.

Charles: You know, they always say the Hamas is d you know, the second coming of ISIS. The Israeli government has been involved in assisting or empowering the Palestinian political and military organization Hamas in various points in its history. The support continued during and in spite of active military hostility between the two sides. Now, I've known this for quite some time. So we have them supporting Hamas that they claim that is, you know, just so bad we gotta get rid of we we have to go flight in Gaza because of Hamas. Now they're supporting ISIS in Syria. At one time you know what, let me bring up something really, really recent. You remember a week or so ago when Trump had to escape in that that catering truck?

Jack Moore: I heard something about

Charles: Remember that?

Jack Moore: it in the news. Not a lot, but yeah, okay. Totally ignorant. I think I did hear s that yeah. Yeah.

Charles: so so he was gosh where was he? He was in Turkey. Yeah. He was in Turkey and there was a alleged threat that Iran was going to try to assassinate him while he was in Turkey.

Jack Moore: Right.

Charles: So he gets on Air Force One on one side of the plane and then escapes on the other side of the plane in a catering truck and then gets onto another government plane. So Air Force One is a seven forty-seven. He gets onto a seven fifty-seven that's parked a little ways down the the tarmac because

Jack Moore: Right.

Charles: they said that there was reports that Iran was going to try to assassinate him. Take a while, guess where that information came from.

Jack Moore: Take a wild guess where what information came from.

Charles: The information that Iran was was trying to assassinate him. I'm gonna

Jack Moore: I'm sure Israel.

Charles: give you one guess. I'm sorry? Who would you say?

Jack Moore: That wasn't a good guess. I said I'm assuming Israel.

Charles: That's exactly right. So how at one time or another can we stop believing what they say? Can we stop? So if hold on. If they

Jack Moore: Okay. I I okay. All right.

Charles: say we have this issue with s with Syria and Turkey d I'm sorry, all you do is lie. I can't believe a word you say anymore. And if you continue believing what what if you you have a person or entity that constantly doesn't tell the truth, when do you stop believing them? Because they have an ulterior motive behind it. And if you can't understand what the ulterior motive is, I don't know what to say. It's right there in front of your face.

Jack Moore: Okay. I all right.

Charles: I don't get it, man. It's not worth us losing losing a true ally like Turkey. It's it's not. Turkey's gone to bat for us more times than enough, man. They they have been they have been there for us when a lot of countries weren't. They have been that roadblock on the Soviet Union for all those years. And we're gonna

Jack Moore: Okay, thirty five minutes in. I think what I'm hearing you say now. I I've been all over I've I've been trying to figure out exactly what the story again, so I I'm not well versed in it. I mean, I see what I do in the news, but it sounds like to me what you're saying is what triggered where you're going, you would have a huge distrust for the Israeli government, which I've s I've heard in all the shows that you've done. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying you have a distrust for the Israeli government and you have a distrust for Washington now because you think it's More beholden to what Israel says to do than maybe even what we should be doing for greater allies. Fair?

Charles: Yes.

Jack Moore: And you're taking this example. Of lobbying bombs over into Syria to send a message, which could be directed again. For me, I'm looking at it like you get into well, you being legalists, I'm like, I don't know. I'm trying to figure out exactly who the players are and what maybe some of what their motivations are, but like what do we see? Mechanically, it looks like to me Israel got a shot in at both Turkey and Syria possibly by doing this,

Charles: I'm thinking about

Jack Moore: but they did it under the cover of not firing the missile into Turkey, which could have unleashed a whole lot different response. response. So whether No, I'm

Charles: D all I'm thinking about is escalation right now. That's what I'm thinking about.

Jack Moore: okay. All this Charles. So what I'm saying is this is from my standpoint. From my standpoint, I think what you what you're driving at is you can see that again, I gotta cut these two, I gotta go look, and it could be a combination of the two. It's a, hey, Syria, when we tell you that we're in some kind of an agreement status that you don't bring Turkey in for dinner, Turkey in for dinner, but if you you're not supposed to bring Turkey over, we're gonna fire some bombs in after they leave so that we don't actually hit Turkey's troops or anyone Turkic officials, but we get our shot in at you to tell you, no, no, that's not acceptable. We can't fire into Turkey. But we're getting a message to you, Syria, you better s you know, straighten up and fly right. And it could be, or a combination of the two. Hey, Turkey, we don't like we don't much like you either. And what the hell are you doing in Syria when we don't want you in Syria? We have enough tension between us anyway. But we gotta stay out of striking you, Turkey. We can't lob bombs over there because we could trigger the NATO thing, strain relations with the US, maybe and bring back a retaliation because what the hell are you doing firing into Turkey? Okay, that's one. Aspect of it. Then what from that you're saying, hmm, what if they did do a direct attack on Turkey? Who would the U.S. even side with? That's where you're going with this. Okay, I got you. But I'm sorry,

Charles: Yes. Yes. Yeah.

Jack Moore: at the first part I was trying to see that as being a direct attack on Turkey. I mean, I was like, I don't know where you're going with this, but because I'm still not clear on whether this was an admonishment of Syria or Turkey or the combination of the two.

Charles: So so how about this? Would you if you were a country if if you were Israel and you were really trying to send Syria a message not to do business or ha come to any agreements with with Turkey Why would you then shoot missiles or drop bombs on the base that the Turkish had just left, possibly taking a chance that there's still Turks there when you could just drop bombs or shoot missiles somewhere else? Why would you do that? Why would you why

Jack Moore: Well there's somewhere else. I I I don't I

Charles: would you take the chance unless you're trying to provoke

Jack Moore: Okay. Your aunt.

Charles: Turkey?

Jack Moore: okay, okay.

Charles: That's why I'm saying this is I'm looking at this as a escalation thing. They they have a whole country where they could have dropped bombs to send Syria a message. Hey, don't do that. But no, we're gonna do it right at the base that the Turk the Turks just left. Yeah.

Jack Moore: Is that right? Is that right? Wait a minute. Are you talking about turn everything around and fi what is this other country they could have fired at to send Syria a message?

Charles: I'm talking about Syria. They had a whole country, a giant country of Syria, where they could they could have dropped bombs or shot missiles to the to let the Syrians know don't do that. But no, they chose to do it on the base that the Turks just left.

Jack Moore: Well, okay. now based upon the reports we're hearing, no Turkish officials, troops, or anything else were injured. Right? No, I understand what you're saying. You're saying shoot the

Charles: No do listen to what I'm saying, man. Okay, listen to what I'm saying. Okay.

Jack Moore: son of a bitch 180 miles over the mountains and hit something else in Syria and don't hit the base. I don't think Syria takes it the same way. I think you drop it on the base because you're like

Charles: Right. Right. No no not but again, man Go ahead.

Jack Moore: Charles, I think what you're saying, I

Charles: Go ahead.

Jack Moore: mean, I get it. You go shoot over the other town or something like that, and then you go, Syria. That was about having the Turks in. And you could go, well, why didn't you just shoot

Charles: Yes, that's what you do.

Jack Moore: it why didn't you just shoot at the base? I mean, where they were. I mean, I don't know. I mean, I think the stronger message was you brought the Turks into this base, therefore, boom, we're gonna we're gonna fire some missiles in. I I think Syria, I thought.

Charles: Who who's the message going to though? No. I'm sorry. I think this

Jack Moore: So you think it's a Turkey?

Charles: dude, I think this is a jab of Turkey. Not Syria. Yo

Jack Moore: Say it is. I say I've I've given you this whole time, it's one or the other or both.

Charles: And that's and that's why I'm only talking about this or speaking on this hypothetically as to what the escalation could be if say for instance say for instance there were still some Turkish dudes there.

Jack Moore: yeah. I I'm with you on that. And we don't know that it wasn't the whole thing's being covered over. I mean who knows? I

Charles: But Israel took the chance. But Israel took the chance of doing this. If they really just want to send Syria a message, they would have shot missiles somewhere else. But no, they shot it at that place that the Turks were just at.

Jack Moore: Okay.

Charles: D this could be a absolute mess for real. For real. Much worse than this Iran thing.

Jack Moore: I don't disagree with you on that. I think most of the places in the world you start firing missiles, especially firing missiles when you've got volatile enemies and volatile countries and all the rest involved, or like you say, those that have these type of connections to an organization like NATO, there could be all kinds of ramifications.

Charles: So one one other thing about this one, and it has to do with NATO. And you know, we probably could do another show on this. I really think people need to you know as a matter of fact, we do need to do another show on this because it's actually gonna be lengthy. But I'm just gonna plant this seed here. People really, really need to understand the years before World War One. And then Not even the ending of World War One, but it's something in October of nineteen seventeen, when they had the October Revolution in Russia. People need to look at the conditions in Russia at the time, the sentiment of the people versus the rulers, and what Russia was doing when it came to World War One. Dude, there's so many similarities right now in the United States as to what happened or as to what happened in Russia do in nineteen seventeen. And it's scary. When you sit down and really think about it, and again we need to do we need to do a an entire show on this. It's really, really scary because it kind of sorta explains why all these democratic socialists keep getting elected. Yeah, there's definite similarities.

Jack Moore: Well, I I d I do know I mean I think it'd be fair to say that In the early twentieth century, there were many tangling alliances among the nations of Europe. And in large

Charles: Yeah.

Jack Moore: part, you had a few ruling families. There's cousins all over the place. The powder keg in nineteen fourteen that had to strike just right to create World War One. People could say it was asinine, but it happened. Then all these alliances go into this. Well, I we well, we got a tree with this country. Tell me if I'm wrong. It's gonna treat with them. Country to fight, and I believe the Russian people kind of stood up and say, Why are we fighting these wars? We're starving to death and these other things. And the revolution,

Charles: Yeah, that's it. Yeah.

Jack Moore: yeah. I see what you're saying. So

Charles: Yeah.

Jack Moore: you're kind of saying we may be in the same situation where in economic strife, tons of endless wars, America kind of always seemed to extend itself everywhere else. It's it's it's a ripe situation for people to come in and say government owes us a living, government owes us this, that, and the other. I think it's the same. Thing FDR faced in nineteen thirty-three. I mean, there's some people that have said, mm-hmm.

Charles: And and a ruling class is essentially saying go kick rocks.

Jack Moore: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well there's been various points. Yeah, I I got it. The one thing I will

Charles: So yeah, we need to do another show on it some other time and yeah.

Jack Moore: say, and then we'll close on this, is one of the things I think we have to cover in the next show is you brought it up earlier, and I know we've discussed it before. I'm still wondering And we'll discuss it. But there is the quote andor statement that Trump made, I think in twenty sixteen, I think it was running for president the first time. where it seemed to me to be kind of one of those barroom type of hypotheticals thrown out or just one of those let's have a few beers and discuss this when he said the thing about NATO. And I know we've kind of argued about this before. I don't think he was saying necessarily he was advocating the end of NATO. He was questioning its f further existence because it was kinda like, hey, wasn't it all founded upon a Cold War measure to rein in the Soviet Union and its and and and how these nations would kind of band together against the countries as communisms creep across the world. And then with the fall of the Soviet Union, I felt like he was saying like, hey, son of that NATO thing. That NATO thing was founded about kind of reigning in the Soviet Union and and communist creep. And why now? You know, and it was like it's it's a valid question, right? And then you're seeing that, I think, as you've stated, as Trump calling for the end of it. I don't know that he wouldn't support the end of it. I think he was just generally asking the question, did I miss something or did the whole basis of his existence end with the the fall of the Soviet Union? So I think it's still a valid question now.

Charles: Yeah, it is. I my gosh. It is

Jack Moore: But it but again, they're two different questions. There's a question of does it serve a purpose still to have a union of these countries that have a common purpose or defense? But is that separated from its original we have to reign in communism? In other words, you could have had many countries with a common interest in reigning in communism or at least trying to stem the expansion thereof and then when it's over, you know we won that Cold War, the Soviet Union just fell, some people might get together and go, Yeah, but you know what? I think we should probably stay together. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, we probably have some common interests. I mean that's possible. You could say, you know what, on

Charles: Yeah, it's possible.

Jack Moore: second thought, let's just kind of keep the coalition together. Well hey, we don't have communism to fight anymore. Nah, but something else might come up and we have a common interest. Can we let some of the former communist countries in? Sure, sure, why not? You know? Then if everybody's in it, then nobody's in it. Then if you know, if everybody eventually becomes in it. Now is it true, would you agree that at one point Putin was trying to trying to find a way in? Yeah.

Charles: It's not even a question. He he actually applied to no, they they officially petition petitioned no, they offici

Jack Moore: Campaign for, I was what I was looking. Yeah. Petitioned, right.

Charles: they officially petitioned to join NATO.

Jack Moore: What, nineteen ninety nineish, two thousand? What do you remember the time from?

Charles: It was it was in the late mm it was the mid the late nineties. Yes, they officially petitioned and we said no.

Jack Moore: Okay. It's interesting. That would've been that would have been the ironies of all ironies, right? Hey, who's a good working

Charles: Well

Jack Moore: member of NATO? Soviet Union? Former. Or Russia. Yeah. Yeah.

Charles: Well, you y y you have to ask how would things be right now if they if they did join? Or they were allowed to join.

Jack Moore: Yeah, it's it's all kind of mind-numbing.

Charles: I think a lot of things will be different.

Jack Moore: Could be. Anything you want to say on the way out? All right, brother. All right, this

Charles: Nope. I'm good. Yeah.

Jack Moore: has been more to consider. Please like and subscribe. again, if you're on Spotify, if you're on Apple, any of those type of platforms, but you're just listening to the podcast, please send some really nice reviews for me and Charles, and we'll see you again real soon. Thank you.